Event Calendar
February 2012
(view month)
S M T W R F S
* * * 01 02 03 04
05 06 07 08 09 10 11
12 13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24 25
26 27 28 29 * * *
<< (add event) >>


User Blox 4
- Put stuff here

Barack Obama
"Lincoln Sells Out Slaves"
by: Rob Kailey - Sep 13
1 Comments
If You Haven't Seen This
by: Rob Kailey - Apr 28
5 Comments
Impeach the President?
by: Rob Kailey - Mar 16
15 Comments
It's the system, stupid!
by: Jay Stevens - Oct 25
7 Comments

Search




Advanced Search


Rob Kailey is a working schmuck with no ties or affiliations to any governmental or political organizations, save those of sympathy.

America's Health Insurance Industry is a Continuing Criminal Enterprise.

by: Steve W.

Wed Jul 29, 2009 at 07:12:35 AM MST


( - promoted by Jay Stevens)

Their greed results in the foreseeable deaths of eighteen thousand (18,000) men, women, and children each year and every year in America. The cause of death is the purposeful denial of access to health care, for profit.

Just like the Drug Cartels, The Sex Traffickers, The Mafia, The Asbestos Mines, and the Tobacco Companies, The Health Insurance Companies make fortunes off the suffering and early deaths of others.

The suffering and early deaths aren't an accident. They aren't a glitch that occurs through negligence, they aren't collateral damage. They aren't something that occurs because the people who run the system callously overlook the pain, death and suffering.

No, they are  an essential part of the racket. they  are the incentive that keeps everyone else paying. They are the whip that keeps people too scared and frightened to stop coughing up the cash.

That is a real and calculated evil and it is why the system must be destroyed. Not reformed, not adjusted, but destroyed.

Can you imagine Barak Obama standing before us and saying, "If I had to start from scratch, I'd give full civil rights to all people. But slavery is 1/6 of the economy, so it's better to build on what we have?" Can you imagine?

Many lawmakers and important government officials accept or have accepted large payoffs from these criminals. And many powerful public "servants" do the bidding of these scumbags.

From George Bush, to Max Baucus to Hillary Clinton to Chuck Grassly, to Barack Obama, these powerful men and women refuse to protect our sons and daughters, our brothers and sisters, our husbands and wives, our mothers and fathers and instead knowingly and complicity choose to protect the interests of criminals.

We are on to you Max, George, Hillary, Chuck, Barack, and your ilk! We have had enough of your criminal associations, we have had enough of your casual acceptance of blood money, and we have had enough of your complicity in the death, disfigurement, injury, and harm that your morally corrupt acceptance and furtherance of an ongoing criminal conspiracy have caused.

At one point in our history we allowed men and women to own other men, women, and children and to exploit them as slaves for economic profit; then, We said ENOUGH!

At one time in our history we let the factory owners and the mine owner work children to death for the profit of the owners. Then, We said ENOUGH!

At one point in our history we let polluters dump toxic poisonous wastes into our water, our land, and our air, that killed and injured people so that the few could make more money; then, We Said ENOUGH!

At one time in our history we let Tobacco Companies market addictive poison to our kids for their corporate profit. Then, We Said ENOUGH!

Right now in our history we allow the health insurance companies to determine if we receive health care, what kind and how much we receive, and to determine whether we live or die. We allow them to bribe our public officials so that they can continue to make money while we go without health care. ENOUGH! ENOUGH! ENOUGH! Things have changed.

Steve W. :: America's Health Insurance Industry is a Continuing Criminal Enterprise.
Tags: (All Tags)
Bookmark and Share
Print Friendly View Send As Email
Health Industry (0.00 / 0)
I noticed the very same comment made by someone called 'John Q. Citizen' at Democratic Underground on July 24th.  I guess great minds must think alike right down to the punctuation and capitalization.  See:  http://www.democraticundergrou...

The first time I saw the 18000 figure was back in 2002.  It was stated in USA Today (http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/healthcare/2002-05-22-insurance-deaths.htm) that:

"More than 18,000 adults in the USA die each year because they are uninsured and can't get proper health care, researchers report in a landmark study released Tuesday.

The 193-page report, "Care Without Coverage: Too Little, Too Late," examines the plight of 30 million - one in seven - working-age Americans whose employers don't provide insurance and who don't qualify for government medical care."

Steve W., I can't reconcile your claim: "The cause of death is the purposeful denial of access to health care, for profit." with the facts from the reported study.


So, you're willing to quibble (0.00 / 0)
about semantics ("cause of death") and causatives... because why???

Yes, any intelligent person knows that lack of insurance is not a communicable disease that causes death.

But for the 18,000 people the article refers to, they died prematurely because of untreated or under-treated conditions. And if they would have had access to insurance (or a single payer system) those deaths could have been avoided, or the inevitable slowed down.

The basic concept still stands: far too many people die from lack of, or inadequate health care. Health care that could have been provided had not the health insurance industry been more focused on outcomes and the general welfare of Americans, instead of the bottom line (read profits) of the industry.

Health insurer profits are nothing more than blood money extracted by lowering the medical loss ratio.

Actuaries are the "Idi Amin's" of the health insurance industry.


[ Parent ]
Two excellent posts! (0.00 / 0)
Blood money! Exactly!  And the legislators that take their money, and do their bidding, have to be called on the carpet!

When they are up for re election this has to be in their face.


[ Parent ]
Programming note (0.00 / 0)
Sage, if you actually think that a post (comment) is excellent, than kindly uprate it.  If you think that someone is simply trolling the site, then downrate it.  You can do that, you know.  Just sayin' ...

[ Parent ]
disengenous quibbling (0.00 / 0)
JC, to point out Steve W's and John Q Citizen's gross mischaracterization of the Institute of Medicine's study as mere semantics is extremely disingenuous.  There are many reasons people are uninsured. "Any intelligent person" knows that to assert that the IOM study suggests 18000 people die because evil insurance companies purposely deny coverage, is a putting forth a lie.

[ Parent ]
How many dying is too many (0.00 / 0)
for you? 1? 100? 1,000? 10,000? Draw your line and defend your decision.

Just because there may be some unknown number of those 18,000 who may have been able to get insurance, and may have been able to afford the premiums, and may have been able to afford the out of pocket, and who may have been able to afford the under coverage, doesn't diminish the plight of the rest.

But to use the existence of some unquantified number of people to dispute my premise, is what I would call "disingenuous."

Either attack my premise, based on the knowledge that there are a significant number of people dying because they have no access to health insurance, or meaningful health care, or offer some hard facts to refute.

Anything less than that, you're blowing smoke.


[ Parent ]
Try again (0.00 / 0)
JC, I am not going to bite on your logic fallacy.  The proof lies with Steve... and he has changed the subject to attack me personally!

[ Parent ]
Logical fallacy? (0.00 / 0)
Show me the logical fallacy that lack of insurance (through recision, and denial to underwrite due pre existing conditions) and access to meaningful health care does not result in premature death.

That's a pretty simple premise. Show me the fallacy.

People don't heal themselves--unless you believe in faith healing. Because that is all that many people have to fall back on when our system of private health insurance fails them.


[ Parent ]
Argumentum ad Ignorantiam (0.00 / 0)


[ Parent ]
So, you're saying (0.00 / 0)
you're incapable of carrying on a substantive discussion because you want to argue logic?

Well, I would start by laying the burden of proof on you to prove me wrong. I know at least one person who has died prematurely because the denial of services by an insurer resulted in an untreated condition (though it was an eminently treatable disease). I know that this particular disease has claimed many other people who have been denied treatment--or effective treatment--by insurers. Whether or not the number of people who have died prematurely is 18,00 or 1800 or 18 is irrelevant.

How many people need to die needlessly before you consider it serious enough to talk about? Talking is cheap though. How many people have to die before you think something needs to be done about it?

Reductio ad absurdum


[ Parent ]
Are you a member of Democratic Underground Craig, or just a lurker? (2.00 / 1)
if you are a member what is your handle? Mine is John Q Citizen. I also used to post on the "My Montana" website as John Q Citizen as well.

My 18,000 number came from the excellent award winning documentary, "Sicko." In the movie there is documentation of a health insurance company causing an insured family man with a wife and kids to die, because they refused to pay for the care he needed to live. They preferred to rip him off for his money and to not pay. That's what their business model is after all. Take in as much money as possible and pay out as little money for health care as possible. They have a fiduciary responsibility to their stock holders to kill people through refusing to pay and through bribing lawmakers to insure we can't get a real health care system.

That's what the insurance industry says too, Craig, "I can't reconcile your claim..." Yep. They are scumbag criminals.



[ Parent ]
Check your facts more closely (2.00 / 1)
Instead of relying on Sicko, you should have checked more closely.  The number comes from the the IOM... and it doesn't say ANYTHING even close to the defamatory crap you assert.

[ Parent ]
What's your handle on DU? or are you just a lurker? I got my number from the excellent award winning (0.00 / 0)
documentary "Sicko!"

Are you saying the number is wrong?

You got the number from USA today. I looked at your link.
Private Health Insurance in an immoral scam designed to rip us off and to bribe our lawmakers.

Between Baucus and Grassley they have raked in millions from the suffering and death caused by the leeches who are preying on our society. there used to be people who defended the slave owners and the sweatshop owners that forced children to work 16 hour days.

I'm not in the least surprised that there are people who defend the criminal health insurance companies.

You know how the private insurance racket started don't you? Two thugs walked into some shop and said to the owner. "Like i think yuose might need some insurance or youse windows might get broken!" Yeah, the protection racket.

Were done with paying the extortion money for our heath care. ENOUGH!


[ Parent ]
Learn to read (0.00 / 1)
I told you I remembered reading it in USA Today.  The number comes from the IOM:  http://www.iom.edu/?id=19175

Of course it's wrong as it is an estimate based on assumptions. BUT THAT IS NOT THE POINT! Even to assume that it is correct doesn't salvage your argument which is a lie that 18000 people died from the criminal actions of insurance companies denying coverage. The study suggests no such thing.


[ Parent ]
Craig, are you afraid to tell me your handle on DU? You got something to hide? (0.00 / 0)
I stand by my statement.

"Their greed results in the foreseeable deaths of eighteen thousand (18,000) men, women, and children each year and every year in America. The cause of death is the purposeful denial of access to health care, for profit."

Live it or live with it.



[ Parent ]
Doesn't matter to me (0.00 / 0)
Steve, go ahead and embrace your LIE or admit you went off half-cocked and made an erroneous half-assed assertion about causation of the 18000.  Doesn't matter to me either way.

[ Parent ]
oh, i wish it were a lie, Craig. But 18000 dead people a year is the sad reality of your (0.00 / 0)
preferred system.

I know you don't care that 6 9/11s a year every year are unleashed on Americans so that some scumbag insurance CEO can make a fat pay check, and so our political system can be bought and paid for by criminals.

That's just who you are and how much respect you have for your fellow Americans.

I know that. And I know you are proud of that.


[ Parent ]
Another lie (0.00 / 0)
Steve, you have become quite transparent by compounding your initial lie by adding another.  You know nothing about me, my life, my challenges, and my experiences.  For you to assert you KNOW is just arrogant ignorance which coincides with your lie about the IOM study.

[ Parent ]
What you assert isn't logical. (0.00 / 0)


[ Parent ]
steve w- this isn't personal on craig's part... (0.00 / 0)
it's a concerted attempt to divert delay and confuse focus on health care reform by several wing nuts in the neocon right. ignore it. craig is simply a diversion. no matter what he says, it doesn't matter. what matters is to stay focused on the real enemy- our own senator max and the parasites he has shacked up with. we need to reach max by telling the truth about the parasites he takes his orders from.

[ Parent ]
yeah craig.... (2.50 / 2)
the health insurance industry is as pure as the driven snow....until they send you or someone in your family a letter of rescission because you failed to mention an appointment for skin acne and are now diagnosed with cancer.

your republican corporate apologistspeak won't wash here. the cases of pure evil being displayed by health insurance parasites are much too voluminous to deny-even for you...

http://articles.latimes.com/20...


[ Parent ]
Huh? (0.00 / 0)
I have done no such thing by pointing out the lie in Steve's argument.  

[ Parent ]
nit-picking details about teve's post does not take away the underlying truth (0.00 / 0)
private for profit health insurers in this country have had the green light to rip us all off while maximizing profits for far too long. they got greedier and greedier until the american public almost universally mistrusts them.

of course,thanks to misdirection (failure to embrace single payer) and waffling, democrats in congress and the senate have failed to deliver a message that resonates.

new polls show  a growing segment of the public mistrusts and or just does not understand what the obama led majority government is trying to do. so the race to the bottom is on. can health care reform withstand the party of no and it's parasitic friends as they whittle away at the will of the american public to hope for change?

or can the democrats actually coalesce into a cohesive unit in time to support a bill that the public can both understand and believe in?

everything hangs in the balance at this pivotal time so of course it behooves craig and other status quo commenters here to try to get us to focus on mini facts rather than the big picture.

we need to light some fires under some pretty alarmingly stupid and oblivious democratic senators and congress people and we don't have much time to do it. so let's try to ignore the party of no for awhile and put our heads together to find a way to get that turkey farm over in washington to listen to us before time runs out....

 


[ Parent ]
more like hyperbole than "lie" (0.00 / 0)


[ Parent ]
Respectfully disagree (0.00 / 0)
Hyperbole is more about exaggeration. Steve is asserting a non established causation and motives of insurers about the IOM number that is an estimate arrived through a meta-analysis and extrapolation of other studies applied to uninsureds. The IOM makes no such causal connection.

[ Parent ]
Menu

Make a New Account

Username:

Password:



Forget your username or password?


Bookmark and Share

Poll
Voting. Useful or not?
Yes!
No!
Maybe, but only if you vote my way.
There are theories that ...
Meh ...

Results

Blog Roll
  • A Secular Franciscan Life
  • Big Sky Blog
  • David Crisp's Billings Blog
  • Discovering Urbanism
  • Ecorover
  • Great Falls Firefly
  • Intelligent Discontent
  • Intermountain Energy
  • Lesley's Podcast
  • Livingston, I Presume
  • Great Falls Firefly
  • Montana Cowgirl
  • Montana Main St.
  • Montana Maven
  • Montana With kids
  • Patia Stephens
  • Prairie Mary
  • Speedkill
  • Sporky
  • The Alberton Papers
  • The Fighting Liberal
  • The Montana Capitol Blog
  • The Montana Misanthrope
  • Thoughts From the Middle of Nowhere
  • Treasure State Judaism
  • Writing and the West
  • Wrong Dog's Life Chest
  • Wulfgar!

  • Powered by: SoapBlox