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Rob Kailey is a working schmuck with no ties or affiliations to any governmental or political organizations, save those of sympathy.

What does Massachusetts mean?

by: Jay Stevens

Wed Jan 20, 2010 at 10:18:33 AM MST


Conservatives are calling it the "Massachusetts Miracle": Republican Scott Brown won yesterday's special election to fill Ted Kennedy's Senate seat.

What does it mean? Does it mean what Maine's Susan Collins says it does?

Sen. Susan Collins, R-Maine, said one of the many messages coming out of the Massachusetts election is that Americans are sick of partisan gridlock, but voters also had a much more expansive recommendation.

"They want better performance out of Washington, they want us focusing on the troubled economy and the need for more jobs and ... they're tired of sweetheart deals that were sneaked into the health care bill. They want that kind of bill to be negotiated in the open. And they're tired of politics as usual and they also want controls. They don't want unfettered, one-party control," Collins told Fox News.

I can't argue with this - I think it's probably true. Of course, Republicans are the main reason there is partisan gridlock in DC, and adding Scott Brown snarls it up even more. As for "politics as usual"...well...I'm not hopeful having Brown as a Senator is going to change that at all. While Democrats have cut deals with insurers and health care providers, their base obeisance pales in comparison to the GOP's usual pathetic grovelling at the feet of corporate America. That is, it's not lkely Brown is the solution.

Jay Stevens :: What does Massachusetts mean?
Or there's the lesson Evan Bayh is taking away from Brown's win:

For Senator Bayh the lesson is that the party pushed an agenda that is too far to the left, alienating moderate and independent voters.

"It's why moderates and independents even in a state as Democratic as Massachusetts just aren't buying our message," he said. "They just don't believe the answers we are currently proposing are solving their problems. That's something that has to be corrected."

What about this health care bill is "too far left"? How could you make it more "moderate"? What is "left" or "right" in the context of health care? What the h*ll is Bayh talking about?

I like what Mike Lux had to say:

Here's the deal: while there are significant differences between Democratic base voters who didn't turn out to vote in very big numbers yesterday in Massachusetts, and the working class swing voters who voted for Scott Brown, these two kinds of voters actually have a great deal in common in terms of what will move them to vote for Democrats:

1. They want big change.

2. They are tired of having wealthy special interests, especially the big banks and insurers, run things in DC.
3. They expect the Democrats to get things done on the big issues of the day- they want jobs created, a better health care system where the power of the big insurers is reigned in, investments in renewable energy, the big banks broken up.

Nate Silver ascribes the loss to Croakley's campaign, the national political environment, and the circumstances of the special election.

I don't think you can get away from local considerations for the upset. After all, it was a Speaker of the House from Massachusetts who said, all politics is local. Massachusetts voters have a tendency to opt for socially-liberal Republicans who promise fiscal sanity. William Weld. Mitt Romney - who was socially liberal until he decided he wanted to win the Republican nomination for president, at which point his approval ratings in the state promptly tanked.

And there's the rub. Brown's already a marked man, caught between a populist, liberal electorate, and a consummately pro-corpoate and socially conservative political party. Kos:

So what will come first? Remember, Brown has to run for reelection in 2012, a presidential year, in one of the top 2-3 most liberal states in the nation.

Either Scott Brown alienates ideologically rigid Teabaggers by casting votes with Democrats in order to shore up his standing at home; or

He votes in lockstep with the rest of his party and becomes the nation's most unpopular senator.
One or the other is inevitable. Maybe both.

 

In the end, I find myself agreeing with Peter Daou. Democrats have failed miserably to govern based on "a morally sound, well-articulated, solidly-grounded set of ideals" and looked "weak." As Daou pointed out, it's something liberal bloggers have been pointing out for months. It's something I've been saying for months. Democrats should have taken a bold, progressive stance and created good policy.

Will they learn their lesson? Probably not. Again, Mike Lux, quoting from The Progressive Revolution:

In the culture of caution that dominates Democratic politics in the modern era, when you try something big and fail, even if the failure is due in great part to your own timidity, you only become more cautious.
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What does Massachusetts mean ? (0.00 / 0)

Good question - it depends on whom you ask Jay.

IMHO;

(1) That it wasn't a rejection of Coakley, who polled well statewide in her Atty General race, it was a rejection of The Great Leader, who made 5 campaign stops there Sunday and was soundly smacked-down.

(2) The voters rejected the Dems strategy of passing unpopular, flawed legislation on party-line votes, and backroom deals to hold their own caucus together.

(3) That the Dems marching with Harry Reid & Nancy Pelosi are going straight off the cliff (Jon Tester for one). The White House seems willing to sacrifice them too, and I'm not sure why - those people aren't fools. Is trying to accomplish 'something' for President Obama that important to them?


Mr Coobs once again shows us he has no clue... (0.00 / 0)
Pretty hard to win with a candidate that takes a two week vacation right after the primary...and its difficult to win with a HCR bill that people do not like tied around your neck...that said...

Evan Byah blames a too liberal agenda...

Lanny Davis in the Wall Street Journal blames progressives and a too liberal agenda....

Do you see where this is going? Do you see what the corporatist Democrats are blaming for Coakley's defeat?  

Never mind that it was the corporatist democrats that wrote and passed the Senate Health Care Reform bill that was one of the major reasons for her defeat.

Never mind that it has been the corporatist democrats, and their support for the big banks and financial institutions with bailouts and no action on regulations, that has pissed people off...especially independents..

No, the corporatist Democrats see her defeat as an opportunity to further their pro corporation agenda and an opportunity to slap down progressives...look for them to step it up today with further attacks on the progressives...


Right On (0.00 / 0)
 
 The DLC Neo-Liberals running this Oligarchy and their Corporate Masters are the same people that brought the Kerry Edwards and Gore Lieberman ticket.
  When the DLC is vaporized - the World will be a better place.

[ Parent ]
Here is an interesting poll (0.00 / 0)
of how people in Massachusetts thinks...

http://act.boldprogressives.or...


By the numbers. (0.00 / 0)
1.  Max Baucus!  THANKS, MAX!  Ol' MB has prominently become the new face of the Dem party, a gutless, blubbering, corporate bootlicking nerd!  I mean, who in the hell wants THIS buffoon as your front man?!  Not me!  I want a street fighter, not a  street walker!  Max DECIMATED the Dems with his completely ineffective attempt at leadeship, hence, alienating the Dems, encouraging the Pubs, and making the Douchebag Party absolutely giddy!  And he did a damn good job of it!  Now, all the Pubbies have to do is re-show his so-called drunken speech over and over and over again, kinda like Dems did with that hairdresser ad for Taylor!

The situation in Mass. is different than here in Montana though.  We've had nutless wonder nerd boy for a lotta years, so it would be easy to dump him outta protest.  It's a little different dumping a lady who has no nutless record like Max.  Them folks is REAL angry!

2.  Watts 1965.  Remember the riots?  When totally disenfranchised peopled have absolutely NO hope left and no other way to protest, they burn and loot their OWN city!  This is what the folks in Mass. did.  They burned their own state to make a statement!  And I can hardly blame them!  I mean, when the systems are no longer even in place to effect change, what DOES one do to protest?  Elect ANOTHER Dem to perpetuate established order, or as a protest send a defiant but highly destructive message the ONLY way you can?  I  would choose the latter, and so did they.  Is it smart?  Well, is it smart to simply continue with Bush's policies?  Either way, it makes no difference.  But at LEAST anger and emotion canNOT be ignored as can a subservient compliance with the status quo.  I applaud their choice!

Look, it's nearly unbearable to read the papers any more and see how much money is going into senseless wars and the defense department when real people are suffering horribly in this country.  How long can people take that before they break?  I think Mass. broke!

3.  It's better to get screwed by a Pubbie than by a Dem.  Ya gotta know your enemy.  Dems are damn TIRED of getting screwed over by Max Barfus wannabees!  If you're gonna get screwed, get screwed by someone on the other side.  At LEAST it's an honest screwing!

4. In order to bring about real change, people must undergo a sufficient amount of suffering.  Any rational thinking person would have thought that after thirty years of this Repubbie clusterf*ck, people would have suffered enough.  And they have.  And EVERYONE realizes this except the Dem leadership! What the hell's WRONG with these people? Have they really no clue as to what needs to be done?  Or are they all really such cowards?  No Dem that I know wants wussy attempts at bi-partisanship!  Oh HELL no!  We didn't ELECT them to suck the big Lieberman!  We really DID expect change, NOT to get hosed with the big Lieberman again and again!

So, the voters in Mass. decided to purposely go back to the regressive Pub days again in order to cause even MORE suffering in the hopes that maybe NEXT time around, a new group of Dems with some REAL balls will finally be elected!  Sad that it has to be this way.  But really, what choice  IS there?  It's kinda like that friend of mine who voted for Nixon way back when.  I asked him why  he would do such a fool thing.  He replied that a Nixon presidency would be SO bad that it would cause the end of the Pub party.  Well, it didn't work out that way.

5.  The Dem leadership has NO idea who they're dealing with!  About fifteen years ago, the state Dem leadership came to GF for some kind of meeting.  Pat Williams was there along with the Dem bigwigs.  When asked for ideas, I said that it was time to take the gloves off when dealing with the rightwing.  I said that it was time to start calling them what they were, fascists!  Of course, Pat chastised me for the suggestion.  But look, the rightwing is out to HURT people.  I've always believed that when you're gonna get beat up, you fight back!  The wussy boys like Baucus don't believe that.  They think that if they're getting attacked, you don't want to make your enemy madder by fighting back.  And people are disgusted with this type of  attitude.  We want fighters.

6.  And lastly, I blame the American people, specifically those who could see this coming for a long time and did nothing out of fear, fear of losing their job, fear of speaking out, and fear of making someone mad.  You get the democracy that you deserve.


Simmer down LK - (0.00 / 0)

You're going to have a stroke !

It's going to warm up this afternoon - go for a nice run !



[ Parent ]
Can't stroke out, Eric. (0.00 / 0)
For you see, I have no health care.  Besides, I already ran.  I do that right outta bed, usually around five or six in the morning.  Best time to run, BEFORE I read the news!  It's much easier to read about the wussy Dems and all their wussy machinations on a good dose of endorphines!

But Eric, if I were you I wouldn't smug out too much.  This is NOT a victory for the Pubs, but rather a defeat for the Dems!  Brown is a complete bozo and the people of Mass. know that.  He was just fortunate and stupid enough to carry a message to DC.  He's a nude centerfold Conrad Burns! Dumb luck! That's all.  It was NOT a democratic vote by any means.  It was simply a tactical, strategic vote.  That's all.  It's NOT the good news you THINK it is.

Why?  Why would I say this?  Easy answer.  I'm about as radically lefty as anyone gets I suppose, and I FULLY support, understand, and applaud the vote in Mass.  Now, think about that for a moment, Eric.  If YOU and I are applauding the same vote, does that not make you rethink just a bit your euphoria?  This vote was the proverbial shot across the bow.  It's a rallying cry.  It's a call to arms!

And it's a clear signal that it's time for REAL, populist Dems to enter the fray!  By that I mean the Grayson-type folks who are willing to fight.  I believe they're out there, and I believe that they'll now come forward.

Eric, we're STILL a democracy in spite of the fact the that Defense Dept. and the corporate fascists seem to be running the show.  I say we get the fight on.  And I think that THAT'S the exact message the voters in Mass. sent!  They WANT politicos who will fight for THEM!  It ain't rocket science.


[ Parent ]
Not smug - (0.00 / 0)

I'm not being smug LK -

You like the National Dems about as much as I do -

I'm glad about this vote, because maybe it'll wake up the administration a little -

They (The Obama Administration) think that they are right, and that the vast majority of Americans just don't get it. But they will put us on board with THEM, one way or the other, like it or not.



[ Parent ]
Quit yer bawling - LOL (0.00 / 0)

I have no clue, but I'm the only one on this blog who predicted it?

Good luck splitting up your own party, and expecting results !


Jay (0.00 / 0)
"Republicans are the main reason there is partisan gridlock in DC..."

This constant drumbeat reminds me of the old Soviet Union fighting WWII over and over and over... to keep the people fired up over a defined enemy rather than look inward to the source of their miseries and demand real change. Eventually, history shows reality wins out.

Jay, I can't make you or anyone else accept my point, the same one that you took issue with  in our previous exchange.  We will just have to wait and see how the old meme of blaming R's for D's flaccid ineptitude and blinding hubris plays out.  


I don't disagree... (0.00 / 0)
...that flaccid Dems are to blame. But you can't ignore the fact that every bill that passes through Congress requires 60 votes. The GOP has refused to negotiate or compromise or even participate in any reform or policy in DC.

If there were a majority vote requirement in Congress, we would see better, popular, and more progressive legislation prevailing. We'd also see the better, more coherent and bold Democrats ruling the party. Instead, the filibuster puts the power of legislation in the hands of the likes of Baucus, Libermann, and Nelson. Instead of good policy, we get crap sandwiches buttered with the effluvia of corporate concession.

If you don't like gridlock and partisanship, your ire should be focused on Republicans. But, as we say in the software biz, that's not a bug in the program of Republican obstructionism, that's a feature.


[ Parent ]
uh... (0.00 / 0)
Anytime procedural obstructionism in the senate becomes a political strategy, then yeah, the party doing that is responsible for gridlock.

But that is different than blaming the reps for the dem's inability to read their base and act accordingly, which is not what Jay is saying--that is your strawman. Dems didn't get elected to do the republicans business--which is exactly what you and coobs, and others are asking them to do: if dems would just act more like republicans, then we could all get along and live in a nice bipartisan D.C.

The history you suggest dems look to for inspiration for change is far different than the history us on the left look to. And the change we want is far different from the change that conservatives want. In fact, the only change that conservatives want is for dems to change to be more like them.

Your asking for nothing more here than for dems to conform to some old ideology that conservatives hold dear and "american." A return to the good ole days of burgeoning reaganism.

Just ain't going to wash here, Craig.


[ Parent ]
Sometimes a humbling loss (0.00 / 0)
serves as an attitude adjustment and a springboard to fresh action.  Other times the pearl is flung aside, as you are doing JC.  People don't want the finger pointing of dialectic ideology served warm or cold.    

[ Parent ]
unfortunately (0.00 / 0)
the springboard of which you speak leaps to the right.

Progressives on the left, on the other hand, see the springboard leaping to the left.

There is no love from progressives for democrats who act and vote like republicans, who are afraid and too timid to advance principled, anti-coporatist positions.

As to a humbling loss, just who, in your mind, should be humbled? Democrats? Or progressives on the left?


[ Parent ]
Just a clarification (0.00 / 0)
It doesn't matter where the springboard leans, but it does matter in what direction the diver springs.  Some Dems will go left, and some right.  The facts say that left is more helpful to the cause of the Democratic party.

But lets not forget.  With the teabaggers in play, the Republicants face the same choices.  Brown was a teabagger before he wasn't.  Congratulations to the Republicants.  They've just elected another obvious liar to the Senate.

People don't want the finger pointing of dialectic ideology served warm or cold.

Apparently, Craig, yes they do.  


[ Parent ]
Disagree (0.00 / 0)
Doesn't matter though.  I just watched Chris Matthews shove a hot rhetorical poker up Howard Dean's ass.  Lot's of disagreement over what it all means and the way forward.

[ Parent ]
If Chris Matthews is pissed with Howard Dean (0.00 / 0)
over this, then obviously Howard is saying something important.

The two have been at odds over health care reform from the get-go. And Matthews has more than a few behind-the-scenes bones to pick with Dean in his previous role as DNC chair, and Matthews' aborted attempt to run for the senate in PA. Saying that they are not very good friends would be an understatement.

Dean is gearing up to lead a progressive charge in this country, now that he sees Congress and Obama squandering the well-oiled machine that he so aptly built with his 50-state strategy, and the mandate that he made possible with the large margins in Congress his efforts helped to build.

OFA has incredibly, completely blundered and destroyed its usefulness to the president, the party, and health care reform. Which is why I have quit supporting OFA, and (like many, many progressives) am getting involved in reinvigorating DFA (Democracy for America--Dean's group) in the wake of Obama's grassroots meltdown.

I look forward to hearing what Dean has to say that so pisses Matthews off. It will be very astute.


[ Parent ]
JC, you have exactly bassackwards (0.00 / 0)
Dean is piss at Matthews over the "hardball" questions that Dean faced. His response was pathetic.

Matthews ignored what Dean (0.00 / 0)
had to say about the polls. The polls that showed that Obama supporters who voted for Brown, and Obama supporters who stayed home overwhelmingly thought that the dems were not doing enough on health care and other issues.

Matthews refused to look at the data and debate Dean's perspective. Which is typical for Matthews in this situation--he's a loud mouth run-on commentator with a lot of preconceived notions he's not willing to look past in order to let his guests make their point. He has never supported the public option. He thinks that dems should take whatever bill the lobbyists and corporate interests will allow them to and chalk up a "win". He's said that over and over during the last year of debate on HC.

Which is why he basically let Axelrod, in the previous segment, get away with passing off the president's efforts the last year as meeting populist needs. That was what was pathetic--allowing the president's catering to wall street and the health care industry and special interests to go unchallenged. The thrill running up Matthews' leg has rendered him unable to critically look at Obama and his staff's mischaracterization of voter and progressive anger towards his performance.

Your saying I (and millions of progressives) have it bassackward is exactly the wrong response that democrats should take from this.

Make no mistake--yesterday's election in MA was a warning shot across the bow of dems across the country. If they listen to Dean, and hold true to progressive populism, instead of Matthew's notion of centrist pragmatism, then they'll do OK.

But if dems listen to people like you and Chris Matthews, then next november will be a bloodbath at the polls. To paraphrase Dubya, they'll take a good old fashioned thumpin'. What Dean did say, and was barely discernible through Matthews' diatribe, was that "this wouldn't have happened if I was still at the DNC," referring to the mistakes the DNC, the Obama admin, and Coakley made in the MA special.

Of course, that's what you and the right want--dems to misread the politics. So I take your argument, and the reverse english approach you're taking, with a bucket of salt. Whatever you say, I'm happier to be "bassackwards" than act like  a concern troll.


[ Parent ]
JC, it's ok for you (0.00 / 0)
to be happy in whatever ignorance floats your boat.  Enjoy!

BTW, it was Dean who got pissed at Matthews over his gentle questioning.  You had it bassackwards, and fail to concede the obvious.  


[ Parent ]
"gentle questioning"??? (0.00 / 0)
hahahahahaha

Yes, Dean got pissed at Matthews. At several points he reflected back Chris' notions that he was being silly. Dean told Matthews to hold up a mirror to see who the crazy one in the room was.

I actually was quite amused by the whole thing. What's Matthews ever done for the dem party lately? There was a reason why he was told to not run in PA. Dean, on the other hand can take great pride in his 50-state strategy that gave the dem party their largest majorities in Congress in several generations.

Personally, I think that Tim Kaine should get canned for the job he is doing at the DNC. Which is to say he isn't doing squat. And dems will suffer heavily for it at the polls this fall unless something changes.

Then again, maybe a return to split government and tepid legislating is what the people want...


[ Parent ]
Democracy at Work (0.00 / 0)
All you people actually take this seriously don't you? Here is the deal, Sports Determines Election!  Coakley mangled the Curt Shilling question and Brown was "campaigning with popular local sports figures". This is your precious "democracy" at work. Sandra Bullock could have won this!She knows her teams and is a babe.Brown has great hair. Thats "politics" in the 2010s people and you ain't seen nothin yet!

What Massachusetts means (0.00 / 0)
1) Hard to assess how much health care reform impacted the vote in a state a) that has implemented health care reform that is stronger than reform being proposed by the bill that passed the senate b) that has an individual mandate/requires people to buy health care coverage c) in which 98% of the residents have health care coverage.

2) Exit polling in Massachusetts reveal that voters don't think Democrats have done enough to address the concerns of working people.

More than anything, the Mass vote showed that people are pissed off - primarily at the slow pace that their concerns are being addressed. People are not pissed off about reform policies - they're pissed off at the pace of change. Their concerns are the same as they've been for some time: jobs and the economy, health care reform, and banking reform.


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