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Barack Obama
"Lincoln Sells Out Slaves"
by: Rob Kailey - Sep 13
1 Comments
If You Haven't Seen This
by: Rob Kailey - Apr 28
5 Comments
Impeach the President?
by: Rob Kailey - Mar 16
15 Comments
It's the system, stupid!
by: Jay Stevens - Oct 25
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Rob Kailey is a working schmuck with no ties or affiliations to any governmental or political organizations, save those of sympathy.

Which will it be? A faith that commands obedience? Or that promises liberty?

by: Jay Stevens

Mon Aug 16, 2010 at 08:36:31 AM MST


Not much to say about the "mosque" brouhaha in New York City, other than Obama was exactly right when he said, "Muslims have the same right to practice their religion as everyone else in this country. That includes the right to build a place of worship and a community center on private property in Lower Manhattan, in accordance with local laws and ordinances." There's really no room for disagreement if you believe in private property rights and the First Amendment's protection of religious freedom.

So it's not surprising that many on the angry right have long opposed the rec center from being built in lower Manhattan and have been attacking Obama steadily for making those remarks, despite Mark Halperin's plea for Republican sanity:

Yes, Republicans, you can take advantage of this heated circumstance, backed by the families of the 9/11 victims, in their most emotional return to the public stage since 2001.

But please don't do it. There are a handful of good reasons to oppose allowing the Islamic center to be built so close to Ground Zero, particularly the family opposition and the availability of other, less raw locations. But what is happening now - the misinformation about the center and its supporters; the open declarations of war on Islam on talk radio, the Internet and other forums; the painful divisions propelled by all the overheated rhetoric - is not worth whatever political gain your party might achieve.

Uh, Mark? Compared to the sh*t the GOP has pulled - the Iraq war, torture, politicization of the DoJ, not to mention obstruction of health care reform and climate change legislation - this would be small change. They've already shredded the Fourth, Fifth, Sixth, and Eighth Amendments, are talking about gutting the Fourteenth, and already have a long and stormy relationship with the First. And civility is not a strongpoint in the Republican party.

Of course, that's not to belittle the question of religious freedom in the country. I think Simon Schama's right on when he claimed that the First Amendment - the separation of church and state - enabled some of the most interesting and vibrant - and peaceful -- religious experiments the world has seen:

In the United States the Founding Fathers believed...that religious truth would best be served by keeping the state out of the business of its propagation; that the power of religious engagement would not just survive freedom of conscience but be its noblest consequence. It was a daring bet: that faith and freedom were mutually nourishing. But it paid off and it has made America uniquely qualified to fight the only battle that matters, not General Boykin's quixotic reenactment of the true god against the false idol, but the war of toleration against conformity; the war of a faith that commands obedience against a faith that promises liberty. That, actually turns out to be the big American story.

Ironically, then, Obama's principles actually enable rightwing Christian conservatism to flourish. The precedent of overriding private property rights and religious freedom would be disastrous to the same fringe elements that beat the drum against a Muslim recreation center near Ground Zero.

After all, the group whose views on the Manhattan rec center most closely resembles that of the right's is Hamas, a "co-founder" of which said the "mosque" "has to be built," seeing it in terms of religious competition. Mosques and churches and temples are the architectural equivalent of religious armies encroaching on enemy territory.

I say we turn our backs on Hamas and Pam Geller. Let the law of the land prevail.

Jay Stevens :: Which will it be? A faith that commands obedience? Or that promises liberty?
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The culture war in our country continues to be between the forces of intelligence, tolerance, and justice and the forces of ignorance, intolerance, and injustice.

It happens that Democrats are, by and large, siding with the former while Republicans, by and large, are siding with the latter.

There have been times, far too many of them, when darkness has prevailed over enlightenment.  The rise of fascism in Germany in the thirties is but one recent historical example.  

The elections of 2010 and 2012, when (because of the "enthusiasm gap" between Democrats and Republicans) Democrats are likely to take a drubbing, could lead to a huge victory for the most reactionary and immoral elements in our country.

Democrats promising to sit out upcoming elections because Democratic politicians haven't been good enough progressives are doing their part, in my opinion, to hand the country over to people like Sharron Angle, Sarah Palin, and (oh, yes) Tea Party Caucus member Denny Rehberg.

We live in a time like an earlier one described by Yeats: "The best lack all conviction, while the worst/Are full of passionate intensity."    


Put it in context - (0.00 / 0)

If the Japanese wanted to buils a monument at Pearl Harbor to memorialize their victory it'd be squashed immediately ans we'd have never heard about it.

uh... (0.00 / 0)
...dude, your analogy is ridiculous. It'd be as if there was a Japanese-American community center built near Pearl Harbor, not a "memorial" to celebrate a "victory." Do you even know what the proposed site will be? Think Muslim YMCA...


[ Parent ]
You are kidding, right? (0.00 / 0)
Are you at war with Islam like we were at war with Japan?


[ Parent ]
The Religious Right is WRONG!!! (0.00 / 0)
Folks are letting their emotions take control of their brains in this instance.  This Mosque isn't going to actually be built on "Ground Zero," but just near that site.  If we agree that the concept of religious freedom is a main cornerstone of our nation's founding fathers' dreams, then this Mosque must be permitted to build on its own private site.  

People forget that there was also a Mosque in the Pentagon on the day that the hijacked plane flew into this five-sided military complex.  People forget that innocent Muslims (Islamists) also died on this day--not just the Muslim terrorists.  People need to start thinking with their heads, and not just reacting emotionally to a very traumatic event that occured in this country.  

How can we ever demonstrate to Muslims that we are a country that embraces ALL religions, not just Christianity?


people also... (0.00 / 0)
...don't realize there are already mosques in the area...

[ Parent ]
Also porn stores, I understand. (0.00 / 0)
But I guess they're OK on "hallowed ground."

[ Parent ]
Don't sugar coat it - (0.00 / 0)

This mosque is intended to be a monument, to the triumph of Islam over the infidels, nothing more.


the plain truth is (0.00 / 0)
until the economy improves, the american public is easily stirred to anger and resentment toward the party in power no matter how specious the complaint.

whatever the far right serves up is sticking and whatever obama and the democrats say is going in one ear and out the other. nothing we can do about it. my solution is to give the far right the stage for now instead of wasting energy arguing with their innane positions.

pay out enough rope and they will hang themselves eventually.

i still think that their idiotic antics are driving away enough intelligent people to allow the democrats to maintain a slim majority in both the house and the senate this fall....
now what good that will do is anyone's guess and open for debate. so far not so good.  


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